President Obama got cut up pretty bad in the debate tonight which was
- Inexcusable. And (as far as I can suss out)
- Part of Team Obama's Grand Strategy of being calm and presidential and remaining likably above the shark biting.
Romney walked in knives-out and spoiling for a fight, but wearing a dynamite vest and nitroglycerin underpants; Obama showed up sleepwalking and apparently under the impression that it would be ungentlemanly to bring a box of matches to the proceedings.
From "The West WIng":
From "The West WIng":
TOBY: It’s happening again.
C.J.: Toby...
TOBY: It is.
C.J.: He was good.
TOBY: No, he wasn’t.
C.J.: He was what he was supposed to be.
TOBY: He was Uncle Fluffy. It’s Dr. Jekyll and Uncle Fluffy all over again.
And so whenever Romney lied about numbers -- which was often (27 lies in 38 minutes to be exact) -- Obama smiled tiredly, walked right past it and started talking haltingly about...what?
Marginal tax rates?
Job creation?
I can't even recall.
Whenever Romney ran some jaw-droppingly dishonest bullshit about Obama's lack of bipartisanship and across-the-aisle-reaching -- which was also often -- Obama stared down, limped away and started talking meanderingly about...what?
Currency devaluation?
The atmospheric pressure on Mars?
I honestly couldn't tell you.
About 10 minutes in, it appeared to me that Romney figured out -- Holy Crap! -- this guy isn't going to fight back. At all. I can say the sun rises in the West and...and nothing. I can say there's no life on the Moon because Liberal over-regulation killed all the Moon people...and nothing.
And from then on it was Katie bar the door.
Of course, the gigantic lies on which their entire campaign is built remain Team Romney's glass jaw, but a glass jaw can remain perfectly shiny and jutting and functional forever if no one ever lays a fucking finger on it.
26 comments:
Agreed. Obama needs to take the gloves off for the next one, for sure. BTW, did you see Chris Matthews? He just about had kittens: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/10/03/chris-matthews-where-was-obama-tonight/
Someone aired a theory that all the zinger talk and blackity black black videos were a feint by Romney to scare Team Obama into doing...nothing, but above all else, do nothing.
Romney's October surprise is to lie and say he's been moderate all along. He even threw his own kids under the bus. He threw Ryan, Republican ideas, everything under the bus and ran as Massachusetts Mitt again, yuking that he's all for the working man.
And Obama let him, because pointing out a lie MEANS YOUR ANGRY OH MERCIFUL GOD DELIVER US FROM THE FROWN OF THE HALF-BLACK MUSLIM.
I mean, even Team Obama buys that media narrative shit, so they made him mainline Ketamine until his eyes looked like black holes, and sent him out to stutter about fuck-all.
I'm gonna vote for Ugthuk'nok, the Beast From Beyond The Moon if this keeps up and I hear Obama "agree" with Mitt about Social Security again.
It's pretty difficult at this late stage of the game for Obomber to pretend that he doesn't fundamentally share the GOP agenda with minor exceptions along the margins. Think about it:
Bowles-Simpson Cat Food Commission, Obama Initiative (hereafter O/I)
Silent Bob routine during the Madison, Wisconsin demonstrations of '11 after Tea Party lunatic savages public sector unions in a naked act of class war, O/I
Non-committal as former henchman Rahm Emanual assaults the Chicago Teacher's Union in the ongoing promotion of the charter school public education privatization scam, O/I
Non-prosecution of Wall Street hustlers, O/I
Committed refusal to utilize FDR-style government stimulus to address plummeting demand in the economy while insisting that the private sector (led by the same banks that cratered the economy) can pull us out of recession, O/I
Unprecedented attacks on whistle-blowers featuring as a bonus the declaration of Bradley Manning "guilty" before his kangaroo court date, O/I
Single-Payer generational death blow, O/I
Saber rattling with regards to Iran, Af/Pak, Yemen, Libya, Somalia, etc, O/I
Granting himself the right to kill anyone on earth including American citizens without due process complete with Tuesday night kill-list jam sessions, O/I
Distinguishing himself from a long tradition of rabidly pro-Zionist administrations by declaring Jerusalem as the rightful capital of Israel, Palestinian claims be damned, O/I
Employee Card Check.. DOA, O/I
Further wage-destroying "free-trade" agreements, O/I...
This is hardly an exhaustive list but the picture it paints should be fairly clear: Barry, despite entering the White House with both houses of Congress, a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate, and a powerful mandate from the electorate for a genuine change of direction, cannot run on his record. What was he supposed to say to an "opponent" who means to accomplish directly, i.e the eradication of what's left of the New Deal and Great Society, what he hope to accomplish by sleight of hand?
Maybe Obama needs a tougher debate sparring partner, he should get Grayson to replace Kerry!
Obama didn't fight back?!?
WhoEVER could have foreseen THAT!?!
John Puma
Terrible.
Unless Obama is a zen chess master......
No, it was terrible. Fight back, genius.
Excellent post, driftglass. The only possible bright side: Maybe now liberals will stop talking about how Obama has the election in the bag and start taking this race seriously. Unfortunately, that won't be much of a bright side if Obama loses the election.
The reason the president wont say he will protect social security is because he believes in the Grand bargain bs.
Well, everyone on the "Outside" has had their say.
I want to know what the Inner Circle thinks. Was this planned? Is there some arcane "Long Game" that will become clearer in debates 2 and 3?
We won't know, until the book(s) are written, circa 2014-2024. Until then, we will just see our AXELrods spinning madly in the mire.
In high school I was a second on the debate team. However, I did very well at extemporaneous speaking (a position on a controversial topic is chosen for you, and you have a certain time to prepare & deliver an argument), going to state and getting A's the last three years.
With that (somewhat related) speaking background - nearly 40 years ago, gulp - I have to say Obama really let me down. Not forceful, no rebuttal - hell, even if you throw that out - no strong arguments for his side of things and little to no pointing out the flaws in Romney's arguments.
I was debating (no pun intended) running over to UW-Madison to see him this afternoon, but it pains me too much to see how well he does in front of a crowd (likely today) versus how poorly he did last night.
Good morning, Mr. Glass.
So Mr. Obama confused himself with J.O.S.H.U.A. from Wargames, and the debate with Global Thermonuclear War (only way to win is not to play)? Groovy. This is why I tend to ignore Campaign Obama in favor of Actual Obama.
If it helps, though, just consider that if Mr. Romney wins the White House, he'll likely end up as another President unpersoned by the Republicans once he's done.
I work weeknights, so I couldn't watch the debate. From what I've been reading on the Web, the debate seems to have revived Candidate Deadmeat the way Nomad revived Scotty.
Normally, an incumbent going into an election year with such a dismal economy would be toast. If the Reptilians had not become The Party Of Scary People, Romney would be running off with this election, instead of just now making a comeback.
obama didn't fight back -- not even on the medicare advantage $716 billion bullshit that cleaned democratic clocks in 2010 -- because
a) he is a howard baker good government republican from 1978 and has never been an actual democrat his entire career, and
b) he entirely lacks the fighting gene
the first instinct of any real democrat after 2008 would be to rip the rich man's head off and stuff it up his ass
grand bargain here we come!
WIth a modicum of respect to the long-winded troll upthread, there was no "filibuster proof majority" in the Senate in 2009-11. Get over yourself. That would have taken 60 Senators - not including the DINOs in the pretty Red states who can't be bothered to stand up to knuckle-draggers in their own states.
Yeah, the President looked like a sparring partner who'd been paid to take the beating - if not a dive. Hopefully it's a wakeup call, because the beating that he took included many new instances of Romney issue gymnastics - including the triple lutz/axle with a twist of throwing is super fun extra taxcut under his own bus whilst saying "What?"
That and the abject vagueness of what replaces all the evil bad things the Evil-librul fascist Kenyan Socialist got passed that New and Improved Willard wants to repeal should be enough to pound up his backside in the worlds most unforgettable colonoscopy ever.
Don't shit yourselves bama knew exactly what the hell he was doing.
Why would that be. Dims seldom fight back like they should.
Samo all over. Will bama pull a Kerry or I guess he did. Don't watch this nonsense because this is what you get.
This is political party Centrism and it's fucking us hard and it's all we're gonna get.
LTFO !!
Last night's debate, according to Mike Flannigan, was full of sound minus the fury.
Obama kept it boring and whatever the ratings were, they'll be lower for the next debate.
Charlie Pierce called it rope-a-dope but after taking all the punches, Obama still didn't throw any.
So long as Obama holds a big lead in Minnesota, I'm voting for Jill Stein. This shit has to be punished, but not in a way that gives us Mitt fucking Romney as President.
(Another great line from Charlie was that Mitt needs a passport to go visit his money....)
I made it a point to avoid watching the debates. As far as I can tell, it's Mitt Romney's attempt to make sense of his policy and gain some more voters.
The reason why I hate watching this is for the simple fact that Obama and his campaign do not have faith that the truth will save him. He believes the debates is his only chance to give us his flowery and vague policy and try to make them sound as solid as possible.. not a real battle between ideas based on credibility and facts.
Obama isn't going to try to demonize the Republicans, which they truthfully deserve. He's just going to try to sound reasonable -- which is the opposite of what he's doing when you consider the republicans.
In short, they're both talking to us as if we're idiot.. which a large majority of us are.
Instead of trying to build the case that republicans ideas simply don't work and that republicans are partisan to the point government can't work, he's just going to rely that he's a nice guy.
This is a case where the american people need to be educated, and instead of using his campaign time to make that effort.. he winks to us who have some knowledge and play nice guy for everyone else.
Obama doesn't believe words need to mean anything. Politics for these people became a religion.. That why he doesn't try to correct Mitt Romney. If republicans try to pin trickle down economics on Obama, just move on and say what he's really doing -- without any acknowledgement that Mitt is abusing words.
So is anyone going to mop up the blood from the wrist-slashing emoprogs upthread or are we just going to stick a "wet floor" sign up and be done with it?
Yeah, throw your votes away on protest candidates, idiots. Whine. Cry. But don't fix the system - that would be actual work and might bring you into contact with - GASP! - people who aren't living in delusional fucking fairy-land! And we can't have you rubbing elbows with those lower-class slime, right?
This election isn't over and the system doesn't stop on November 7. If you can't figure that one out, then don't bother voting anymore. Go back to squeezing out crocodile tears over the poor, put-upon brown peopel half a world away at the local organic market, while folks like me try to fix things so you don't have to.
Anonymous at 12:40 PM,
I don't vote for politicians who will sell me down the river. EVER.
If that means Romney wins, so be it. Maybe that'll lead to a new Democratic or other 3rd party, who won't nominate politicians who will sell me down the river.
Not sure why having politicians earn the vote of those they hope elect them is such a bad thing.
Berto
Thanks for the post, Driftglass. This is EXACTLY what I was feeling last night.
On a side note I've been explaining the GOP lie machine in the following way: It's a Cheney-buckshot-shotgun-blast-to-the-face. As anyone tries to explain why each any every goddamn pellet is a lie, they're reloading. Oh, and it's okay that you're getting shot because, well, you know, we're friends.
I thought that Obama did well to explain his ideas, but the only people that heard his ideas were the ones that were already listening to him...
He needed to call "bullshit" every time Rommney opened his mouth. As is "I will not respond to your remarks except to say every word was garbage. For my remaining time, here is the truth."
@Anon 8:52
Ok hot shot, enlighten this poor rube on just how Obummer can run on his record. What's the O'bomb got up his sleeve? Some mind-meld technique that will erase the past four years from our collective memory?
Obama has the stump, which is quoted every night on every news channel, and they're all looking to revive the horse race by now lifting Obama as he burns Rmoney for every lie he told during the debate.
It was rope-a-dope for one round. Two and three are coming up. More lies from the right, more factathon for the left. Truth does out. Americans can be offended by blatant lying, which Obama has tricked Rmoney into doing.
We needed Kirk - we got Spock...
Starskeptic wins 10,000 Internets for that one. I am SO jealous that I didn't think of that first. ^__^
Both these guys have been running since 2007. Do you really think that there is some large number of undecided voters or voters who might change their mind? Yeah, its not sexy to say that Obama has had this in the bag for some time now, but it's like a chess match. Obama is a pawn up with a winning position, and now he just has to play it out. He's not going to lose because he had a bad debate. In reading the coverage today, and Mitt's various comments, I'm surprised to learn that Mitt won. Then again, I had the advantage of not watching the debate.
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